IFH 794: The Art of Film Marketing: How to Make Your Movie Impossible to Ignore with Danielle Raiz

Alex Ferrari 0:07
Enjoy today's episode with guest host Dave Bullis.

Dave Bullis 0:44
So on this episode of the podcast, again, we're going to be talking about marketing short films being used as actual commercials and so much more. As we talk all about this wonderful, wonderful world of filmmaking and video, we also talk about a lot of really cool projects as well, with guest, Danielle Raiz.

Danielle Raiz 3:15
So I started my career in consumer media startup, so I've always been about creating tools for creatives and for for all sorts of creatives, from you know, better ways to show these photography online and video online, and musicians and stuff like that. That came two weeks because we saw that there's a huge user base of the video creators that it didn't have the perfect tools for their needs. And at Wix, we're all about empowering users. And you know, different users have different needs. So we came, we came to this project in order to help video creators grow their business, and knowing that for a video creator, their content is their business. So it's all about, you know, better showcase, better distribution options, stuff like that.

Dave Bullis 4:05
So, Danielle, when you're you know, obviously you see a ton of different things. What you know, with your position, you see a ton of different filmmakers. You see a ton of different videos. You know. What are you can you think of any off the top of your head right now that have just been like, Absolutely, like, astounding. And you're, you know, because you know, everything is digital. Now. We have so many tools at our disposal, it's almost overwhelming at times. But you know, you know. And sometimes you see projects and that just come out of left field, and they're just amazing. You know, have you run into any and you could think of the top of your head, you know, during your course of Wix

Danielle Raiz 4:40
Wix website, or in general, or just in general. So in general, I think that it's a really exciting time to be a video creator, because there are a lot of new ways now to create content which are really interesting. I see, for example, our users, you know, experimenting with 360 videos and VR and it's really. A whole new way to look at how you create content and how people engage with it. Also, if you look at the platforms that people are using, you know, Facebook, etc, so you get a lot of like live engagement. So it's really interesting to see, you know, how creators evolve, how they create content, in terms of how this landscape is changing over time. And so this is the one thing that I find really interesting. And I also think that there are a lot of tools in the last year, in the last couple of years, that are about giving Video Creators, you know, the power to control their careers. So up until now, you're kind of like you had a few video services, and you kind of had to play by their rules. And now that you have all the power, because everyone's chasing after all the great video creators out there, you can actually decide. You can actually control the way that you're displayed and the way that you're monetizing your content. And you have so many platforms to choose for from, which is amazing. So I think these are really exciting times.

Dave Bullis 6:05
Yeah, and you mentioned something that I usually talk about on this show, and that is, you have to sort of create your own, sort of what I call a stake in the ground. And basically what that is, is, you know, you have to get a website, and that is your stake so in the ground. And you know, mine is Dave bulls.com and basically that way, when you're actually out there and you're, you're making stuff, you can upload it to a website. And this is, I think, is key, because now I don't know it's just maybe, if it's just me, but whenever someone says, who you know, who's does, you know, creative work, or artistic work, and they say they don't have a website, I kind of go really like, you know what I mean? It just if it seems like it should be second nature at this point.

Danielle Raiz 6:42
Completely so I think this provincial artist, you know, your site is really your business card, and when you people talk to you, they'll just go to Google, they'll Google your name, and they need to find, like a professional, beautiful online presence, because it actually reflects on how they look at your work. So you really want to have control on how this is displayed, and, you know, Wix being Wix, we're really about, like, giving you all the tools so you don't have to think about how to create your website or how you know how to design it. We're just giving you everything, giving you all the tools that you need so you can just focus on your content and just put it, you know, in a beautiful template, and that could customize the entire thing and make it your own. So when people go to your site, you know, they feel they see your site and your logo and your brand, and you know, it's all you, and it doesn't really matter where the content is coming from.

Dave Bullis 7:31
Yeah, that's true, and especially now with video becoming what it is so important in marketing and advertising, you know, I mean, you know, for instance, you go into a lot of these video sites. And, you know, like, you know, Hulu voodoo, you know, YouTube, and you see the, what you see those ads before the video, and they're short films. They're no longer, just like people, you know, pitching you things. They're a literal short film, you know. And the product is, is what's being marketed, right? You know what I mean,

Danielle Raiz 8:01
Definitely. You know, businesses started realizing this video is really the most engaging way to connect people to their brand, to their brand, and to showcase their products. So they're actually the ads. As you said, they're becoming like little films that are incredible. You know, you've seen that. For example, I think the big fashion houses. Now they released to YouTube such incredible clips and short films that are all about, you know, showcasing a certain dress that they're selling or a certain collection. But it's like, it's like a film production, for sure. So this is totally something that is interesting.

Dave Bullis 8:37
So, so Danielle, you've had a few filmmakers come to you and come to Wix in general. And you sort of help them along. You know, I know, in talking with Vivian, you know you, she mentioned you have to an evening with Bucha and slate goods and NYC. And you know some of these. You know different projects. You know, when they come to you, what are some of the things that you sort of cover when you're when you're talking to them. Is there any sort of, like, do you have like, a sort of, like, a template, a check sheet that you go through, or is it sort of, you base it upon every different filmmaker for when, when they're gonna, you know, obviously, when they're coming to you with with advice for video and for websites, etc.

Danielle Raiz 9:17
Yeah. So the thing about slate, and the two examples that you gave slate goods and the and the evening with Bucha are two incredible, incredible examples of the platform. The thing is, we didn't reach out to them until after they actually created their website. Because the thing is, it's such a do it yourself platform. They didn't really need any help from us or any guidance for us. And they created two beautiful showcases. So slate New York, they're doing, they're selling Snickers and what they're working with nonprofits. So they use video on their website to connect people to the nonprofits that they work with to tell their stories, which really helps business. And you know, it's not like, it's not like the typical video creator, but it's someone that's realized. That video helps you sell. And it helped connect people to your brand and everything with Bucha. It just became one of my favorite stories, because the thing about that movie. It's a film that was, it's a documentary film that actually premiered in Venice festival, Venice Film Festival last year, and then slam dance and several other festivals. And the thing is that the director actually found a bunch of tapes of his mom, who was a journalist, like, I don't know how many decades ago, interviewing Charles Bucha, the writer, and it was so good, he decided to make a movie out of it, and he created this amazing documentary. And then he creates a website for it. And on the website, you know, you see, you can watch the trailer, you can see all the festivals that it's showcased in, and then you can, you know, contact him, and you have to press area and everything. So when you go there, you actually, you know, you hear the entire story behind film, and it's fascinating. So these are actually two great examples, you know, different uses for people who are either filmmakers or not, same filmmakers, adult realizing the power of video.

Dave Bullis 11:16
So then it's sort of, you know, take that a step further. Danielle, if you were to have somebody sort of come to you then, and a filmmaker and and he or she wanted to put their films, you know, use Wix to build a site, put some videos up, you know, you know, what? What advice would you give them? You know, obviously, because you mentioned you got to talk to the two filmmakers after their movies came out. But, you know, but if we, if you had the opportunity to talk people before those movies come out. You know what? What was would be some of the advice that you would give them?

Danielle Raiz 11:46
So I think the first thing I would say is, you know this, creating, creating movies and videos these days, it's not like a one way thing. So you have to engage with your viewers, and you have to do it even before you start filming. So you build your own website, you create a teaser, you put whatever content you have there, you start talking to your fans and engaging with them. You share behind the scenes and updates and teasers, and you really create a buzz about your film before it's even out there. And then once it's out there, so you revamp your website a little bit, and you make sure that the movie is available, you know, either for sale or even just a trailer if you want to do the festival run. But just keep, keep users like, keep your viewers engaged all the time. This is something that's really, really critical in my eyes. And then you know, if you add to it, like a director statement and interviews with your cast and exclusive content, and people really have like, they get a lot of your website. They really connect to your vision they need. They understand why you did what you did, and what you're trying to say. And I think this is, you know, what, just watching a video without all that context, you know, it's not as powerful as it can be. And the fact that you can engage with your fun defense in such way, the fact you can even, you know, send them updates, and, you know, even live stream from the set, you know, use whatever you have at the moment. You don't have to have the entire and film ready in order to start working. You have to start working on it a lot before it's done.

Dave Bullis 13:12
Yeah. And that's something I tell crowdfunders too, as well, is, you know, you have to sort of build that audience before you launch your crowdfunding campaign, because a lot of times, you know, they'll launch, and then they'll try to find their crowd that way, but you know what I mean? And then they, they sort of are trying to, they're sort of putting the cart before the horse, instead of actually saying, Let's build up an audience now and then, when we launch this thing, we'll be able to actually have an audience, and we'll actually have an audience that we can actually, you know, talk to once we launch this crowdfunding campaign. And it's the same way with the movie, you know, you want to build up an audience, and then by the time the movie comes out, you already, sort of, you already have that audience who said, Hey, Wilson, we've seen, you know, we've seen the poster, we've seen the trailer, and now we actually want to see the whole movie.

Danielle Raiz 13:57
Definitely, I totally agree with you on that, and I have to say that, for example, having a website for crowdfunders is really like, it's even essential, because it helps you appear a lot more professional than you you know you're not, you're not just another Kickstarter project. So you have your own, your own site with all the information there, with everything that you need. And we have actually had some users like that also about creating a buzz before. So one example that I can recall is the user that was he had a horror comedy for Valentine's Day. So what he did was it just, he sent out just a lot of teasers in social media. And by the way, social media, I'm sure you talk about it in your podcast all the time, how critical social media is for filmmakers, but he had a lot of social media buzz before the movie was out that, you know, it's going to be out in Valentine's Day. In Valentine's Day, it's going to be, you know, free to watch entire Valentine's Day, and then it's going to be paid per view. So he created a lot of buzz, and he released it on Valentine's Day, then it just started selling the next day. And all that buzz really, really helped. So, you know, you got. He got depressed, and he got all the social media and whatever. So it's, it was really a cool story,

Dave Bullis 15:07
Yeah, you know, it just to sort of piggyback on that story. Danielle, you know, one time I actually made a short film. It was one of those, you know, weekend film competitions where you have to make a film very, very quickly. And what I did was I actually used Wix to make a I wanted to make just a simple, one page website. I didn't want anything fancy. And I was like, I need something quick, because I don't want to sit here and, you know, do all this other stuff. So I actually used Wix, and I just made this one sheet of, oh, sorry, one page, and it just telling people what the movie is, and a couple little things here and there. And then the funniest thing was, I actually just put like at the bottom, like everything, like, here's where we're gonna be. And people actually responded to that, just that one page or like, because we didn't know what they said, Danielle, they said, Hey, we didn't have anywhere else to go. There was nowhere else to click on. There wasn't like, you know, all these different, you know, tabs the top. They said, You know, it was just very simple and self contained. And they said, you know, we you know, it seemed to get the point across a little better than if I had a different bunch of tabs to top. And you know, I just remembered that, you know, I've always taken that with me over the years. Because whenever I'm done, you know, thinking about making a different website or whatever, I'm always thinking, you know, I shouldn't make it too busy to give people too many options. You know what I mean? Like, I don't want to have a page where it's like, watch this and then this and then that. You know what I mean. I want to make it so it's like, it's all sort of, it's like a path, like a linear path, if you know what I'm trying to say.

Danielle Raiz 16:34
So I take them through the journey. It makes a lot of sense. You know? You put what moldy you pull you put, for example, your most recent video on the top. You make sure they watch a recent thing, and you then, then add some, you know, either tabs or below the fold or whatever, with additional content for those who are interested in more. And you can connect between them. And you can split in, you know, categories and tag and keep people moving throughout the journey of your creation. It makes a lot of sense.

Dave Bullis 17:03
So, you know, as we sort of talk, you know, about content creation, you know, it seems like everyone's getting into that now, you know, I mean, all these different platforms are, you know, looking towards creating different content and stuff like that. And, you know, I wonder if, if it ever, I mean, I know this is, this is obviously, you this is kind of speculation. But I was, I would always wonder if different websites would be entertaining that even more like websites we don't even think about. You know what I mean, like, because, you know, if you look, the latest person I heard getting into, into con original content is voodoo, and that's owned by Walmart. So you got voodoo, you got Amazon, you got Netflix, YouTube, of course, does their thing and, and, you know, as I look out into the landscape, I wonder, you know what? What other websites and companies are going to start creating their own original content with shows and, and some of which, like we were discussing earlier, are going to just be commercials for things that are coming out. You know what I mean, like, you know, maybe, you know, like, different companies can focus on, you know, a new item or coming out. For instance, I knew a guy, he actually made a Star Wars short film to to promote these lightsabers that they had made. And they actually got, like, a got the actual license to make these lightsabers. And they actually, the trailer was just these two guys battling it out in a lightsaber fight, and they and that's how that was. Their whole marketing campaign.

Danielle Raiz 18:32
Sounds very cool. And yes, there are a lot of services. And you know, the thing is, and it's just, when you go to each of these services, you usually need to play by their rules, but then if you put everything on your own domain, so it's basically, we have the ability to showcase all the videos in one place. So if, for example, if what you're talking about right now, like, you could create some, you know, specific kind of content for Facebook, and then you could do something for YouTube or for female and you know, each platform has their own, you know their own style and their own, their own you know your intent of like, why you're doing what you're doing. You go to YouTube for the viral, and you go to vim because there's an amazing Creators community. And then you do like, live and viral and play, you know, things on a on Facebook, and then when you have all that content everywhere, it's kind of nice to have your own domain when you can showcase they're all in one place. So this is one thing that we put a lot of emphasis on. We know that creators just they have their content running around everywhere, and it's really hard to keep track. And you know, it looks different everywhere. And, you know, you keep using each of this platform for their own like each in their own advantage, but then you want, on your own side, to have the ability to control everything and to just say, Okay, this is all the things I created throughout all the platforms and everything, but this is mine. So this is one thing that we put a lot of emphasis on. And, you know, make it an easy to. Grab your videos from everywhere, and just say, Okay, this is, this is all Dave's work, you know, no matter where it's from, this is all day's work,

Dave Bullis 20:17
Yeah. And that's very true. And you know, there's, there's speaking of, you know, putting on, like, everything in our portfolio, you know, I wanted to ask, you know, what advice would you give about SEO? Because, you know, every No, Danielle, everyone talks now about, you know, if everyone does have a website, or if everyone does have a channel, you know, we, you know, how do you actually, how do people actually find it, other than, you know, word of mouth. So, you know, because, obviously, because you've seen all these different things, you know. What advice would you have for somebody to, sort of, you know, make sure that their SEO, their search engine optimization, is actually locked down and and so that way people can actually, if they are searching for maybe something like, you know, if they're searching for basketball or ping pong tables or something like that, that they can actually find your videos.

Danielle Raiz 21:01
So, actually, SEO is something that Wix put a lot of emphasis on. So we actually have tools that automate this entire process for you and help you make this, you know, the best you can find. Because, as we said in the beginning, when people will want to look things up, they'll just go to Google, and then they just real, you know, they go there and they say, Okay, I'll probably like, you know, whatever comes up on the first page, this is what it'll probably build click. I think the most important thing is just to make sure that you have a lot of information on everything that you add on your site. So you want to, you know, you want to fill in all the details of everything that you do. For example, if you're filmmaker and you have your know, your crew and your cast and the description and everything you want everything written down, because basically Google just looks, you know, for good solid content. And if it's good solid content, what you have there, and, you know, the favorite video, so that's even better. So you should be fine. And and also, you know, there are a lot of tools to optimize your SEO, which I think everyone should definitely use because this is something critical these days.

Dave Bullis 22:04
Yeah, it's, you know, was we talk about this podcast, you know, it's a war of eyeballs and ears now, because you know everyone, you know the playing field is even out a lot. You know, obviously, you know, hard work and talent still count. But you know, if everyone has a camera, you know you have to be, you have to be, you have to, especially, be able to stand out from the pack.

Danielle Raiz 22:24
Definitely.

Dave Bullis 22:25
So, you know, as we sort of, you know, go on with this conversation. Danielle, I wanted to ask, you know, when you're putting together a website, you know, what are some of the things that you usually tell people to make sure you focus on? I mean, is there any anything you know, you know, beyond, you know, obviously, since we're talking a lot about video, is there anything sort of beyond video that you make, that you tell filmmakers, you make sure to put this on your site so it looks, you know, it looks and feels and and it is a complete site.

Danielle Raiz 22:55
Yeah. So for filmmakers, what I would say, besides, you know, having all your content there with all, you know, the additional in front everything is connect, all the social channels that you have. You're probably using, you know, Facebook, Snapchat, whatever you want to use. Them all. You want to show all the buzz around your films and all the activity around it. You want to share updates and behind the scenes and stuff. I would probably do this in like, a production blog, which could be great for filmmakers, you know, to get people engaged with the movie, and then always have a press section, you know, make it easy. You want to get coverage for your film, even if it's, you know, not yet, like, not yet in production, but you want to get some coverage. You want to you want to get somebody make it really easy for media to find what they're looking for. So they have, like, a proper press section with all the media they need, with your context info, make it easy for them to help you, to help you get, you know, the coverage you want. Same goes for screenings. You know, there are so many apps and stuff you just, if you're already out there, just, you know, have all your laurels out and have all your screening dates and everything. So people know where to find you. And I think that's, that's the most important thing.

Dave Bullis 24:06
You know, I wanted to ask to Danielle, you know, I don't know if the answer to this question, so I figured I'd ask you it, are forums still a thing? You remember forums like, you know, back back in the day, you know, where people would actually have, you know, you know, where they could post different, you know, things. I mean, you know, I don't even know if that's a thing anymore, but, I mean, is it? I mean, do you do, do, you know, have you seen filmmakers or even other users, actually, you know, try to make, try to put forums into the website and maybe have any, any type of sort of engagement with it?

Danielle Raiz 24:37
So, yes, definitely. The thing about forums is that people, a lot of times, you know, forums is just another way to create a community around something. And if you're interesting enough, or you're doing something that's interesting to users enough, they'll come and they'll read and they'll engage in they'll also want to comment, which is, you know, makes perfect sense. So I do think forums are definitely something that you should have if you. Want ongoing engagement, but it needs to be interesting enough, so I would probably create a forum around something very specific, for example, your Star Wars example. So Star Wars fans are, like, hysterical, okay, and if you have a forum that's all about, you know, Star Wars fans and creating media around it, and things that would totally engage, you know, viewers coming to your site, help them stay longer, and help get them really connected to what you do. So it's just a strong way to create a community,

Dave Bullis 25:31
Okay, you know. And that's a good point, because I see, you know, I haven't been on forums in a while, and I've always wondered if that that was still, you know, a viable option. Because, again, you know, like we were just saying, there's so many options out there now. And I, you know, it's you know, you have so many different things to choose from. It's hard to sometimes, you know, wonder, you know, what do you mean? What if that tool that you, you've used before is ever is still going to be, you know, a good option if you know, I'm trying to say so, it's you know. But you know, as you sort of bring this back to video, you know, even with video, you know, some of the thing, you know, the tools that that I've used in the past, you know, you can use some of them still, and other ones, it's, it's just like you can't do it anymore. For instance, I used to, I had a mini DV cam that, you know, if I used it, now, I feel like I'm kind of, you know, shooting myself in the foot, because I'm giving myself an extra step, because you have to take the to take the DVD, the DV tape, out of the camera, you know. You have to, you know, digitize the footage so you can, so you can start editing it in something like Premiere or advid, you know. And it's just, you start to say, Well, wait a minute, I want I just shoot digital to begin with, and eliminate this whole process, you know, you know what I mean. It's just, it's just how things change anymore, so rapidly, you know, in the world we live in now,

Danielle Raiz 26:46
Definitely,

Dave Bullis 26:50
Sorry, I'm sorry, Daniel, I mean, interrupt you. I'm sorry.

Danielle Raiz 26:52
I'm with you.

Dave Bullis 26:55
Awesome. So, you know, and that's something I also wanted to ask, too, is, you know it you know, where do you see, you know, Wix going in the next couple of years, in terms of, you know, video and everything out and everything like that. I, you know, with everything, sort of, you know, we talked about all different things, you know, is there any place that you would you can see Wix going?

Danielle Raiz 27:18
Well, I'll tell you this thing, we're like, we're evolved. We're here to empower Video Creators. Okay, so as this industry evolves and as the technologies change, so we're going to evolve with that. And we want to provide, you know, easy access to all the tools you're already using. We want to help you, as we said, build a community around your content. So we're always going to find the most, the best and most innovative way to do that and and I think that this landscape of, you know, currently, we're talking about, you know, showcasing and distributing your content, which is something that has changed dramatically in the last couple of years. And if you look now, then you'll see that, for example, on demand, which is something that you know, talk to me like, 10 years ago, I wouldn't believe that someone would pay for video on demand. And today it's like, it's the most obvious thing that you can, you know, sell your content directly to fans. You can sell, you know, your you can sell your skills, you can sell tutorials, you can do so many things with it. So this is something that we could never imagined. And now this is so common, and this landscape keeps changing, so we're just gonna, we just plan to change with it.

Dave Bullis 28:29
Yeah, and, like we were just saying, you know, everything changes so rapidly now, and you have to, sort of, you know, be, be it, be ahead of the curve, and, and, you know, again, that's where I go back to with, you know, content creation, and you know, being able to get, be able to get your stuff out there to your fans directly, because, you know, that's what you know has happened with technology. You know, over the past even, let's just say, 10 years, you know, you've cut out the whole middle man, and now you're selling directly to your fans. You can make a whole, you know, a website, and you can and talk directly to people. And once those people find your website, you can start, you know, engaging with them. And, you know, hopefully make a fan for life. And then, you know, that's something, you know, I always wonder where the next iteration is going to be, but, but you know that that's what I mean by, you know, how everything has changed is, you know, maybe it'll be completely different than what we think it'll be, or maybe it'll, you know, versus it, you know, changing increments, if you know what I'm if you know what

Danielle Raiz 29:23
I mean, yeah, I think I'm pretty sure, you know, I'm pretty sure that things are going to change and like different, like levels. So the technology is changing dramatically all the time, and then the engagement levels that you have, and are changing all the time. So it also, it also affects the content that you're creating. So suddenly, you know you create like a live stream and you talk to people directly, or you create like a 360 movie, and you make you you make your viewers. You know they can select their next scene or where they're going with it. So there are so many things that are changing. Changing it once.

It's going to be very interesting to see where creators take this, because they think it's really the power is really in the creator's hands, on how they're going to take this amazing, you know, these amazing technologies and these amazing opportunities and create, like, ground breaking experiences. It's all about like, creating an experience, not just like now, once you know, many years ago, you would sit in the cinema, just watch a film and just go out, and now it's like a whole experience, experience you're getting into, and everything is getting a lot more interactive. So as time goes, it's going to be really interesting to see what creators do with it. And I think that they just like they'll be the ones to decide where this is going. You can have the most amazing technology out there, but if you don't get creators to create amazing things with it, amazing experiences with it there, it's not going to work.

Dave Bullis 30:58
That is a fantastic point. Danielle, that is absolutely fantastic. You know, Daniel, we've been talking for about 30 minutes, give or take. You know it just in closing, is there anything that we haven't got a chance to discuss, or that you want to discuss now, or maybe even something you wanted to sort of say, to put a period in this whole conversation

Danielle Raiz 31:18
And listen like, if we're talking about like Wix in general, or Wix video specifically. So the thing to remember is that we always have creators in mind. So it's always about, you know, having people that, giving people the ability to to have complete control over harder content is displayed, like you work so hard, you know, on your latest short film or whatever, you should be the one to decide how it's displayed, where it's displayed, how it is monetized. You should be able to sell it directly if you want to not rely on any other service. Should be able to do it on your own domain, like it's all about, you know, providing control and given the given the power back, I think, and this is something that we're doing. So we're fairly new service at the moment, and we keep evolving this and improving this over time. And I think we have amazing things, you know, coming soon, that I'm not even able to discuss, but I'm sure you will follow up or through this, and I'm sure we'll keep talking. And it's been a pleasure,

Dave Bullis 32:25
And you know, and obviously we're definitely gonna keep talking. Danielle, and I just wanted to say, I'm sorry, one last question was, where can people find you out Online?

Danielle Raiz 32:34
So you can find us at wix.com basically, you have a whole section for video creators with a lot of beautiful, stunning film templates and templates for video creators. And then you have the with video app and within the site, where you can have all the amazing features we talked about.

Dave Bullis 32:53
And do you have any like personal Twitter or anything you want to give out?

Danielle Raiz 32:58
Danielle, not really. I'm a LinkedIn kind of girl,

Dave Bullis 33:02
By the way I shot you a LinkedIn friend request, I'm great, so feel free to decline that at any time. No, I'm just kidding around. But you know, I'm really good. I just, I made sure to, I looked, I was looking for if you had any social media, like a Twitter or anything. And LinkedIn came up, and I was like, Oh, there she is. I'll send her a connection request.

Danielle Raiz 33:26
But I'm all about giving other people to stage. You know, I'm providing, still giving other people the stage. I'm a backstage

Dave Bullis 33:36
Well, Danielle, I want to say thank you so much, you know, for coming on.

Danielle Raiz 33:40
Thank you for having me, Dave.

Dave Bullis 33:42
You're very welcome. Take care Danielle, bye!